three shootings I’ve been involved in I had an explosive blow up on my bike at one point Dave Crawford who was killed worked for me for eight years so I was directly involved in that. I’ve been involved shootings and I mean there’s been dozens of other incident related things after that first shooting I didn’t experience any any bad things no PTSD no bad dreams no anything it was I processed it, i did what i need to do I mean look back at the entire incident or anything I could have done differently or anything like that no there wasn’t and that was it the negative side to me was our department at the time if you’re involved in shooting they kept you off the street for until the investigation done is done and after that first incident i was pulled off the street for four and a half months on administrative duty sitting around doing paper work. that was the worst part of that incident that was a regular midnight shift it was I don’t know what happened during the shift it was typical and I come about 7:20 something in the morning and i’m just sitting there I have no idea what is going to free reports or something normal into the shift thing and then on our channel which was different than a channel that started developing on we get the out of the out of the total silence units we have a 10-24 which is our department’s emergency drop everything and go over 10-24 we have officers down inside a a house that’s like a knife through the heart I mean shots fired officer down is that’s, you’re just gonna have a massive adrenaline dump in it’s you don’t know what’s going it’s just I gotta get there that’s when you’re kind of going on autopilot you’re not really consciously thinking of what’s going on the incident itself involved a barricaded person in an attic and it was an ambush situation it was already officer shot there was two off one shot downstairs in the bathroom there was another officer with them we were hearing hearing calls to you know help me get us out of here things were things were very fresh after that shootout I i told you about my previous shoot up big deal i mean this one here was I think the difference in some of the things that officers experience if you could differentiate aftermath probably a big a big a big factor is whether you’re truly in peril or not my first one if I look back on it yeah the guy pointing a gun at me but I was so prepared so fast i took that before I mean did I feel he was going to shoot me yes I took care of it very rapidly in the shootout in the house there were there are bullets coming through the ceiling that I seen the bullet holes opening up as i’m shooting back it was the it was a urban warfare shootout with in a house and I shouldn’t walk out of that I have no idea how I walked out of that and when you’ve got these things not only you’re involved in a shootout and things like that where two officers did get killed but why in the world did i walk out of the house I probably shouldn’t I don’t know why I’m sitting here today when you talk about aftermath of of it and initially following that following that incident I mean I that’s what i did have the classic textbook responses to things and again I reiterate i was involved in a previous shooting it was i’ve been involved in multiple pursuits you name it I’ve probably done it I broke half the bones in my legs and arms and I’ve torn things and it’s just part of the doing the job and this one here it was probably different in a sense it was just emotionally was just an overwhelming that overwhelming experience now I did I experienced some of the things that you will it i had the bad dreams I had the nightmares I mean up until and I still to this day depending on what’s happening around me or experience I do I’ve had you know I had the nightmares I the couldn’t sleep wake up in cold sweats and I can’t tell you how many times I did that initially but they cleared us come back to work within three days that’s probably a little too soon you know what is right now four and a half months on the first shooting three days on the second shootout what is right now the answers I don’t have an answer for you but i can tell you that given the totality of that situation three days probably too much yeah after this I mean this was such a shootout with such a huge huge event in st. Pete I mean it was first of all we had an officer killed in 30 years now we just lost two and in one morning it was broadcast all over everything was live there was live TV out there when eventually SWAT teams went in front end loader was used to to bulldoze part of the house I mean there was a lot of things that happened there that had never happened before so this was a huge huge huge event and then the aftermath they’re trying to figure out who did what you want to give awards and all that so there were few also got different awards initially we got the department’s medal of valor and that was at a big ceremony they did four months later and now that was their first big award ceremony you would think that I would say that shootout was the worst day of my life that awards ceremony day was probably the worst day of my life i didn’t want go I was coached into going, you have to do this is for the community it’s for this is for the community it’s for the people in reality we shouldn’t be doing things like that for the community for the people I understand getting information out and doing this and all the honoring things but it was in my opinion way too soon it was way too many things going on and that particular day was awful. again i’m still supervisor on midnight shift i’m doing my thing there and and david crawford and who worked for me for eight years close friend of mine and shots firing officer down I probably be there in a heartbeat a half I think it was the probably the second or third person there and he’s down I ripped his shirt open he’s got a bullet hole right in his chest and so here we go again watching your good friend shot to death is critical incident and it was just it doesn’t matter if you were involved in a shooting know i have again it was the same thing is you’re gonna have the same emotions the same responses there’s nothing that says you know there’s no flow chart that says with the shooting you’re going to experience this with a car crash going to experience this and when your partner gets shot killed you can experience this sorry just doesn’t work that way. They all group together you may experience this you may experience this experienced them all. you may experience none and it’s all normal now, you just have to how you process it how you deal with the aftermath is what’s important I got educated i was experiencing i was experiencing a lot of the things I was still working things kind of changed involved too with what I was what I was experiencing you know initially yes I didn’t sleep well I’m hardly slept at all yes i was eating well I have a lot of lot of triggers a lot of triggers were just wreaking havoc on different emotions i was happening and all but I was still doing my job is still work and that’s what I do. Listen to yourself Listen to yourself and acknowledge some I sound so philosophical, it’s really not if I think that I’m having some issues and some problems be willing to admit it and just listen to yourself if you think you need a break you need a break you know if you think you need to talk to somebody you probably do you need to listen to yourself and don’t be afraid of ramifications. Listen man, we’re all human we you are going to go through things and if if you ask me prior to that January 11th incident said where you ever experience any PTSD or any bad stuff or any emotional stuff or any of the stuff I’ve talked about I tell you to, shoot, no I’ve been through once I’ve been through it once and you can through it many times it doesn’t really matter i’ll be fine and it’s not